An Idiot Calling The Kettle Black
I get called a lot of names. I get it. It comes with the territory of someone who tweets non-stop with a strong opinion with an air of arrogance confidence.
However, when I get called something like “a complete idiot” from a spamming PR company, it gets my man-panties in a knot.
I hold PR companies to a higher standard since one of their functions is making others look good.
A few months ago, I put out a specific request for Vegas people to get in touch with me through a PR newsletter about a specific topic that I was going to be writing about. I received some great responses, so the world was a good place. About a week later I received a press release about a Vegas show that was a generic email blast.
Yep, I understand the logic. This PR company, seeing my request thinks I’m a media outlet, and using their 1994 way of thinking, they translated it to “this place NEEDS to see everything we promote”. So I decided to correct them, since this email was my personal one and I guard it and know it’s not supposed to be on any newsletter/blast and/or porn list (as opposed to my other addresses?)
So I replied to this very professional person (how did I know he was a pro? Because he was using an ISP email address of course. That’s one step-away from using aol or a hotmail address for business). I requested something very simple. “remove me”:
You can also see sign #2 that you’re a pro: ALL CAPS in the subject line.
I had to reply back to this person, since they didn’t have an unsubscribe link at the bottom, even though it’s required under the CAN-SPAM Act
I figured that was the end of that. But then I got another…. and another for months.
Now it was really starting to ruffle my poorly groomed facial hair. At this point some people (mostly those who spam, pacifists and people that read “The Secret”) argue “Just delete the email and move on. Positive energy!” but I don’t buy that. The onus should not be on the receiver to delete these emails. So after replying multiple times to “remove me” I took it up a notch:
You’ll notice there is also an email address to the Las Vegas Review Journal. No, I didn’t add that in to do the jackass move of “I’m going to tell the newspapers about you!”, he not only used the BCC function in his email (I can only assume using Outlook Express to send it out) but he used a newspaper contact in the “To:” in his original blast. It’s like he just completed the tri-fecta of moronic email blast moves. The only better move would’ve been putting everyone in the “To:” so everyone could reply-all about removing them from the list.
Amazingly enough, I finally got a reply:
Other than the fact that he replied in the subject line with nothing in the body, this is perfect, right? Yay! I wrote back to confirm, yes, the email that you sent the original spam PR to and that I was writing to you with was in fact the email I was asking about. (My reply was simply “yes”) which initiated a reply with something like:
“We will search for it. We have multiple databases that will take us a few days to go through”
I’m paraphrasing here since I deleted the original email. What puzzles me is… who takes a few days to go through email lists? Are they on the old tape reels that are in a storage closet? Is it by hand? Can’t you run a search in your Outlook Express or at least call AOL support to help out a wonderful customer?
After a few days, I received this reply from the potential tech-saviest PR company of all-time:
They just HAD to add the part of how they were a big deal in Vegas. Vegas, my fave place on earth. My home away from home. Oh no you didn’t. Everything else was fine! Let me know I’ve been removed, thank-you and we’re good. But something stuck me with that one clout line, so I decided to give them a little advice:
Was it necessary for me to reply like that? Of course not. But that one line smacked me of arrogance and I needed to let them know the irony of what they said. They’ve been using my personal email as their PR fax machine, I think I was entitled to give them my thoughts.
Which then brings us to the best part:
Really? I’m all for a good ole-fashioned pissing match, but come on. You don’t know how to use email properly, not to mention the compliance issue, you take days to find an email address and this is your stance?
It seems to me that a PR company has a vested interest in sending out targeted releases, with compliant lists and should be happy they weren’t reported.
But what do I know, I’m a complete idiot.
What says you? I would love your thoughts on not only this exchange but PR’s responsibility in general when it comes to email/press releases and client representation. Comment below!
(Note: I debated showing their name/email but after a few days of thinking it over and discussing with some awesome friends, I figured I could get my point across without being “sensational” with it. Would love your thoughts on that as well)
*UPDATE*
I sent him the link to the post so he could enjoy it. I guess he did:
I don’t think he gets it. So I tried to clear it up:
Good times on a Friday!
*UPDATED AGAIN*
Seems our superstar of PR thinks that press releases aren’t covered under the CAN-SPAM Act because he’s not “Selling anything”
Any thoughts on press releases not being spam? My response:
Someone let PRSA know I’ll speak at their event about proper email practices for PR. I’ll even waive my fee. Hell, I’ll waive travel costs 
(note: one of my readers called PRSA just now, they said they’re months away from choosing a keynote for the conference. Awesome)
I'm now wearing size “XXXL” Manties, so I've got some experience on this subject. And I'd recommend that you have THREE emails. One private, one for porn, and one strictly for discussion of silky underthings worn by Oprah-class PR professionals.
But now that we've got “lists” in Twitter, that might not be necessary. I'm adopting a wait-and-see attitude.
Dude.
Too tired to write anything but
Interesting that this HUGE “PR” company seems to be run by a singular one-man show. “I” this, and “I” that – complete narcissist.
Interesting that this HUGE “PR” company seems to be run by a singular one-man show. “I” this, and “I” that – complete narcissist.
[...] had never heard of the un-marketing blog until last Friday, when Scott Stratten posted “An Idiot Calling the Kettle Black” about his back-and-forth email conversation with an agency who spammed [...]
Listing your resume, does not make you correct. The PR person felt the need to deflect from the real issue, that their press release and the method in which it was delivered was wrong. Eventually they will run into someone who, (without the support of awesome friends) will disclose who they are, and their business will be affected.
Not naming names really shows your character. Definitely the right way to go.
I think learning about the negative interactions that can happen in business and online is really important. If we know what can happen then we are more prepared to handle it and much less likely to act this way ourselves. Thanks for taking on the crazy so I won't have to….
And of course, great to read and hilarious as always
….forgot to say that i can TOTALLY picture this guy in his office pounding angrily on his keyboard…too too funny…i'm sure his reputation as an angry typist is impeccable and unparalleled worldwide
Haha Scott, that is totally something I would have done too. Yeah it's easier to just delete, but sometimes it's more fun to try and make a point, especially when something pisses you off like that. I've had more than enough encounters with companies who email like that, now I go out of my way to identify them and report them to every agency and even their other clients if I can, in hopes of getting them fined/blacklisted/whatever. Annoying as hell!
You should have outed this guy (these guys?) and let the world know who they are. And, IMHO, you should have reported them as well. Your email dialog, while an amusing read to us all, won't stop the flow of canned meat from his computer from reaching another X,000 people.
Burn the guy or at least out him and let us all send him a Press Release.
[...] was reminded of Scott Stratten’s recent interaction (on a much smaller scale) of his “An Idiot Calling the Kettle Black” experience with a PR company. I did laugh hysterically at that [...]
[...] How to Add Retweet Buttons in Your PDF Documents | Social Media Examiner 2 Likes UnMarketing » Blog Archive » An Idiot Calling The Kettle Black I get called a lot of names. I get it. It comes with the territory of someone who tweets [...]
Apparently he is clueless. This is depressing that there are people paying him to do work. Smoke and mirrors it seems.
[...] bloggers to people on Twitter, friends, co-workers, colleagues, jackass PR people from Vegas (ok, just one) and my family, leaving out one of them would do a great disservice to everything you all have [...]
GREAT POST!! Good for you Scott! Keep us posted. I hope you get the speaking gig. If you're not available have them contact me, I'll carry it on for you.
That is a good case study. Of a grandiose manic depressive. Not knocking the bipolar – they have their struggles that most of us can only vaguely imagine. But I certainly wouldn't want to entrust one clearly not taking his meds to my PR campaign.
[...] or lumped in together with a large, homogenized group. If you are not cautious, the situation could end like this poor guy that decided to pick a fight with Scott Stratten after what sounds like a horrible initial [...]
Glad to see you took on the Windmill and won!!! I’ve attempted similar things in the past, but have usually gave up out of shear frustration.nnThese are same people who used to send out “news releases” (if you can call them that) on mass by fax, until they started getting the long distance phone bills and then switch to email.nnI wonder how he/she would feel if their email addresses was added to all of your followers own email lists and then in one shot we all sent out automatic updates of every tweet? Of course I could easily create a mailing list of 1. And spend several days/weeks looking for the list and going through it.nnWhat most people in the traditional PR/Marketing space still don’t get is you never know who you’re talking to via email or in person these days and how a single individual can sink your business. That’s why the golden rule of “simply be polite and nice to everyone” has to be followed.nnSo my hat’s off to this 20 year veteran of PR, who doesn’t know how to manage his own PR. We should all attend his keynote and ask questions about remove links and how to respond to complaints from PR blasts.
I hope you get the Keynote speech (right ahead of his speech). Another great post, Scott.
This is one of the most amazing things I’ve seen this month. This person can’t be in PR. They may be involved in a particular tactical execution function of PR, like events and promotion or something, but this person cannot have an APR from PRSA or really be on the circuit. If they are, I may have to reconsider my membership and involvement;-) I really want to know who this person works for, like really bad. In answer to your question, PR is a management function. It’s about relationships and customer service to a large extent. The customer is always right mentality very much applies, as PR serves as the liaison between an org and its publics. To take the text book definition further, PR is the link that determines ultimate success or failure. So… PR’s responsibility is to protect who they represent AT AL COSTS. Doesn’t need to involve kowtowing or anything, but it does mean acting like a grown up, professional, interpersonally and human savvy person who understands what’s truly at stake when one communicates. They would then need to take that foundation and be able to emulate it on the Web. This was a great post Scott. Thanks.
Glad to see you took on the Windmill and won!!! I've attempted similar things in the past, but have usually gave up out of shear frustration.
These are same people who used to send out “news releases” (if you can call them that) on mass by fax, until they started getting the long distance phone bills and then switch to email.
I wonder how he/she would feel if their email addresses was added to all of your followers own email lists and then in one shot we all sent out automatic updates of every tweet? Of course I could easily create a mailing list of 1. And spend several days/weeks looking for the list and going through it.
What most people in the traditional PR/Marketing space still don't get is you never know who you're talking to via email or in person these days and how a single individual can sink your business. That's why the golden rule of “simply be polite and nice to everyone” has to be followed.
So my hat's off to this 20 year veteran of PR, who doesn't know how to manage his own PR. We should all attend his keynote and ask questions about remove links and how to respond to complaints from PR blasts.
I hope you get the Keynote speech (right ahead of his speech). Another great post, Scott.
This is one of the most amazing things I've seen this month. This person can't be in PR. They may be involved in a particular tactical execution function of PR, like events and promotion or something, but this person cannot have an APR from PRSA or really be on the circuit. If they are, I may have to reconsider my membership and involvement;-) I really want to know who this person works for, like really bad. In answer to your question, PR is a management function. It's about relationships and customer service to a large extent. The customer is always right mentality very much applies, as PR serves as the liaison between an org and its publics. To take the text book definition further, PR is the link that determines ultimate success or failure. So… PR's responsibility is to protect who they represent AT AL COSTS. Doesn't need to involve kowtowing or anything, but it does mean acting like a grown up, professional, interpersonally and human savvy person who understands what's truly at stake when one communicates. They would then need to take that foundation and be able to emulate it on the Web. This was a great post Scott. Thanks.
This made my afternoon! LOL. Holy crap.nnI just had the same thing happen to me. There was no option to remove me from the list…nnThis is just part of what they said ” Considering that you first asked us to remove you from our mailing list, then please also remove us from your mailing list.”nnI have an unsubscribe feature on my newsletter. They didn’t. If we both had it, this convo would have never happened.nnThanks for sharing Scott!nnChris
I think the reason is there in the e-mail. He’s been representing people for 36 years with some success. If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it, right? His 36-year-old marketing techniques are still perfect, so why change?
This made my afternoon! LOL. Holy crap.
I just had the same thing happen to me. There was no option to remove me from the list…
This is just part of what they said ” Considering that you first asked us to remove you from our mailing list, then please also remove us from your mailing list.”
I have an unsubscribe feature on my newsletter. They didn't. If we both had it, this convo would have never happened.
Thanks for sharing Scott!
Chris
Sounds like our hack is:nhttp://www.celebrityspeakersentertainment.com/about.htmlnnHe is the PR person he lists above:nKatie is available for appearances before Corporate and OrganizationalnMeetings for Keynote speaking, seminars, or workshops.nFor speaking engagements bookings contact Bruce Merrinnbruce@katiecallawayhall.com | 702. 367.0331nfrom: http://www.katiecallawayhall.com/contact.htmnnhey bruce, enjoy you stupid hack. good one mr scott!! i will put this in our spam bot to make sure it gets blasted on all 300 major search engines. it will only take a few milliseconds. nbrucey is such an egostical idiot. bye and have a nice day
I think the reason is there in the e-mail. He's been representing people for 36 years with some success. If it ain't broke, don't fix it, right? His 36-year-old marketing techniques are still perfect, so why change?
Sounds like our hack is:
http://www.celebrityspeakersentertainment.com/a...
He is the PR person he lists above:
Katie is available for appearances before Corporate and Organizational
Meetings for Keynote speaking, seminars, or workshops.
For speaking engagements bookings contact Bruce Merrin
bruce@katiecallawayhall.com | 702. 367.0331
from: http://www.katiecallawayhall.com/contact.htm
hey bruce, enjoy you stupid hack. good one mr scott!! i will put this in our spam bot to make sure it gets blasted on all 300 major search engines. it will only take a few milliseconds.
brucey is such an egostical idiot. bye and have a nice day
I don’t know anything about PR or marketing (my area is in health/fitness), but I follow you for your sense of humor, and I think I’m in love with you. Regardless of his right to contact you in the first place, his response and demeanor was absolutely ignorant and unprofessional. nnI’d love the name of that guy and that company so I can electively never use them for any business endeavor ever.
I don’t know anything about PR or marketing (my area is in health/fitness), but I follow you for your sense of humor, and I think I’m in love with you. Regardless of his right to contact you in the first place, his response and demeanor was absolutely ignorant and unprofessional. nnI’d love the name of that guy and that company so I can electively never use them for any business endeavor ever.
My blood is boiling just reading this. People like this guy just drive me crazy. He obviously is very impressed with himself and his “fabulous” PR firm. ugh! I am sure after Oprah reads the Unbook she will be having you on her show!
I don't know anything about PR or marketing (my area is in health/fitness), but I follow you for your sense of humor, and I think I'm in love with you. Regardless of his right to contact you in the first place, his response and demeanor was absolutely ignorant and unprofessional.
I'd love the name of that guy and that company so I can electively never use them for any business endeavor ever.
I don't know anything about PR or marketing (my area is in health/fitness), but I follow you for your sense of humor, and I think I'm in love with you. Regardless of his right to contact you in the first place, his response and demeanor was absolutely ignorant and unprofessional.
I'd love the name of that guy and that company so I can electively never use them for any business endeavor ever.
My blood is boiling just reading this. People like this guy just drive me crazy. He obviously is very impressed with himself and his “fabulous” PR firm. ugh! I am sure after Oprah reads the Unbook she will be having you on her show!
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